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NEW RULE
http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10137&t=48903		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Chris Pile [ Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:48 pm ]
Post subject:  NEW RULE
Never working on an Ovation again. I don't need the money, and I darn sure don't need the aggravation. Wretched POS.
Author:  sdsollod [ Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Never liked 'em...
Author:  Glen H [ Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Way to go! Who needs more aggravation? Send all those ovations to your least liked competition! I fortunately have never worked on one so I guess it could be said that I don't know what I'm missing! Well, I guess I do from what I've read.
Author:  Freeman [ Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
I will say (and I'm rather ashamed to admit it) that I once shaved the bridge on an Ovation. It need a reset, obviously I wasn't going to put that time into it (rumor is they use epoxy in the joint) so, with the permission of the owner I shaved it and cut the slot deeper. At that time I too vowed never again....
Author:  fumblefinger [ Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Just send them over to me Chris. Us Ovation owners can commiserate with one another.
Author:  Hesh [ Mon Jan 23, 2017 6:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Chris Pile wrote:
Never working on an Ovation again. I don't need the money, and I darn sure don't need the aggravation. Wretched POS.



Yep one of the biggest POS ever to darken the doors of Luthier shops world wide and they are now at the stage where most of them need neck resets.... Can you imagine that at one time Ov*tion had 1/3 of US guitar sales?

We won't work on them and try as hard as we can to not belittle the poor schumck who who struggles up two flights of stairs to bring us one.... :? :D I usually put on nitrile glove and a dust mask before opening the case and this usually causes some fear in the owner's eyes.... :)

We refer the clients to local hacks who can lose their souls on them..... but of course qualify the referral to the client indicating that many pro shops won't work on them and why, ep*xy encrusted things that they are......

I did make an exception for a terminally ill young man who had an old Ov*tion 12 string and our local famous venue, the Ark was hosting a concert for him to get a life saving operation. His 12 needed everything as they often do. Over a few weeks I did what ever it needed, handed it back to the guy and ripped up the bill because I could and wanted to. We haven't heard from him in over a year and I fear that he passed. After the work on his guitar he wrote us a song and put it on his web site and sent us a link.

I'm remembering this story because as much as Ov*tions are utter crap..... at times there is a decent human being attached to them. Sorry for digressing.....
Author:  B. Howard [ Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Guess I'm the only idiot with a soft spot for these canoes......Can't help it, wanted to be Glenn Campbell when I was a wee lad.
Author:  Frank Ford [ Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
The thing about working Ovation guitars is mostly a matter of how we talk to their owners. We try to explain the best we can why certain operations are not possible, some require parts we can't get, electronics eventually become obsolete and fail, etc.

Refretting, some structural work, and many other operations are quite possible, but as with any other instrument, we try to be as gracious as possible explaining the cost/value relationship. We need to have that discussion about any number of old inexpensive traditionally designed and made instruments, as well as with previously repaired or poorly made modern or new ones.

It's all part of being in the service business. . .
Author:  Hesh [ Mon Jan 23, 2017 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Don't tell any one but I actually owned one in the 80's.... a black one....:)

One thing that we didn't discuss is how our benches and even our laps.... are useless with these round bottomed things.... Ever try to play one sitting down without a strap?

And it should also be mentioned that the heritage of Ov*tion is a helicopter company who's core competency was damping vibration.... :? :roll: :D
Author:  Chris Pile [ Mon Jan 23, 2017 4:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Quote:
And it should also be mentioned that the heritage of Ov*tion is a helicopter company who's core competency was damping vibration.


In some circles that would be denoted as "a clue"..... duh
Author:  DanKirkland [ Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Yup, my rule has been there since I did a bridge reset on a REALLY cheap one (the "applause" model I think)

The finish was so thick that in order to get wood to wood contact I had to cut and chisel (you read that right) the finish off the top and then use spruce and plane it down flush with the surrounding finish to glue on the new bridge. I turn down every single job outside of very basic structural stuff (cracks that need cleating, binding popped loose etc...)
Author:  sdsollod [ Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Brian, I remember seeing (and loving) Glen Campbell jammimg out on his Ovation on the "Good Time Hour", but I could never get past the plastic...
Author:  Guitarizzmo [ Tue Jan 24, 2017 1:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
DanKirkland wrote:
The finish was so thick that in order to get wood to wood contact...


That's because it is not a finish, but an acrylic plate, laminated to a sheet of wood, that is thinner than a normal soundboard! :o

I too shy away from repairing them besides fretwork, changing tuners and electronics. I have had the pleasure of falling victim to taking on top and bridge repairs in the past, and knowing that it was designed by a helicopter engineer, called them up for help: [headinwall] They are not only secretive and unhelpful :x , but downright rude and full of themselves :twisted: , and the only ones "authorised" to do repairs :evil: , so if you live far away, good luck with that. If you want information on how exactly they are put together, a few people have taken them apart and done chemical analyses on the glues... and published the results, so there are ways to fix them, but not cost effective ways.

I had one come in for a cracked top, and after finding out that it had the acrylic plate that was a major part of it's structure, all I could offer was to use super glue, and a thin veneer overlay. The owner went for it, but against my advice had me put his girlfriends name on it! :shock: I just wanted to make something to go with the sound hole design.

I do have to point out though that they have a unique and pleasant sound, no other guitar has, so they do have their place.
Author:  Chris Pile [ Tue Jan 24, 2017 7:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Quote:
I do have to point out though that they have a unique and pleasant sound, no other guitar has, so they do have their place.


And that place would be.... the dumpster.
Author:  B. Howard [ Tue Jan 24, 2017 8:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Hesh wrote:
And it should also be mentioned that the heritage of Ov*tion is a helicopter company who's core competency was damping vibration.... :? :roll: :D


You know I spent many years building very high end built in entertainment centers and home theaters in my previous life. The goal here is to dampen vibrations so nick nacks don't rattle when the movie gets loud.....In the process of learning how to damp vibrations and target problem frequencies you also learn the inverse or what propagates and extends them. I find the knowledge from those days indispensable myself and am sure Kamman applied it it the same manner.
Author:  Guitarizzmo [ Tue Jan 24, 2017 1:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
Chris Pile wrote:
And that place would be.... the dumpster.


When it comes to what a good sounding guitar is, personal preference is the only reliable measuring device. Many famous maker's high end guitars deserve to be thrown in a dumpster when compared to many much cheaper no name ones. Just seeing a Martin or Taylor logo on an instrument is enough to fool jaded peoples ears into hearing "Better sound", but a blind hearing test almost always proves that brand, superior craftsmanship and "Tonewood" don't always add up to "better sound" vs cheep plywood of unknown species slapped together in a sweat shop.
Author:  truckjohn [ Tue Jan 24, 2017 4:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
I have played a bunch of Ovations that sounded pretty darned good.... I even retopped one way back in the 1990's when I was in college.... Always wanted to do another one now that I know more about what I am doing....

Turns out that they are easier to work on if your background is synthetics such as fiberglass/CF/Kevlar than if your background is woodworking.... And since I didn't know that it was impossible - it turned out pretty easy.....

I heard all sorts of horror stories after I did it.... I routed off the old top and chipped out all the hard epoxy lining. Roughed the bowl up real good with coarse sandpaper and then epoxied solid wood linings into it... Stuck the top on the linings with regular wood glue and off I went...

But I can understand that for "traditional" repairs - they can be a beast.... Like say you are trying not to cut the neck off for a neck reset... Or glue the bridge back on and have to contend with the 1/8" thick coating...
Author:  Chris Pile [ Tue Jan 24, 2017 4:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: NEW RULE
My post was triggered by their wretched under saddle pickups.... there's just no good way to get the action down. I think they sound terrible, but my taste in tones is not the issue.
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